Author Topic: AdBlock  (Read 10333 times)

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Ferdk

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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #15 on: April 17, 2014, 07:10:16 PM »
Maybe. Then again, you can get around TV commercials too, by recording a program and skipping the commercial breaks when you get round to watching it later. You can't really do that on a video streaming service like YouTube.

You can technically do it. Buy some computer recording software, make a youtube playlist and let them play while you record the screen to your harddrive. Then later you can watch this recording at your own leisure skipping those pesky 30 second ads :P

And as for how youtube pays for advertisements, I've always wondered that too. For what I know it IS about clicks, but I can't wrap my head around anyone really clicking those ads, yet I still get some pocket change money. So, either there's a lot of people who do click ads for whatever reason, or they actually may have some low-rate compensation for "views" on the ad even if they don't click on it.
As for how they know who watched it, YouTube has lots of tracking tools like that. As a content creator, you can already have tools to measure how your videos do for audience retention. You get charts of what parts of your video lose the viewer and stuff like that. I assume a similar tool would easily monitor whether you watched the advertisement or skipped it.

Just because you do, doesn't mean everybody does this.
I haven't watched TV for years (and I don't really have the urge to do).

Well it should go without saying I was obviously talking about people who watch TV. Did you never watched TV in your entire life or is it just now? Because if you used to watch TV, the point still stands. We do not question TV advertisement even though we PAY for the TV service (the fact that you don't, doesn't mean you question the practice) but we condemn having to sit through small adverts on a service that is given to us for nada. That's my point and should still stand even if you don't actually watch TV.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2014, 07:15:45 PM by Ferdk »
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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #16 on: April 17, 2014, 08:39:59 PM »
I'm pretty sure ads on youtube are done on a viewing basis, not click-based.
They're more akin to a TV advert than a regular internet advert.
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Thunderbird

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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #17 on: April 18, 2014, 07:39:51 AM »


Well it should go without saying I was obviously talking about people who watch TV. Did you never watched TV in your entire life or is it just now? Because if you used to watch TV, the point still stands. We do not question TV advertisement even though we PAY for the TV service (the fact that you don't, doesn't mean you question the practice) but we condemn having to sit through small adverts on a service that is given to us for nada. That's my point and should still stand even if you don't actually watch TV.

Actually I'm not attacking your point, but the way you draw your conclusion:
It's an overgeneralisation which you cannot use to make valid points, only barroom cliché.

Let me show you:

Quote
We watch lengthier commercials on TV all the time while paying for the monthly cable subscription and noone bats an eye.

"We watch lengthier commercials on TV all the time"
statement is false, only some do

"while paying for the monthly cable subscription"
statement is false, only some do, e.g. people living at parents house don't do

"and noone bats an eye. "
statement is false, I know people who hate the advertisments on TV

Now you use this to draw an conclusion for everyone on the internet with "It's like on the internet everyone's entitled to have everything handed to them on a silver platter."

It's useless to argue with that, as it isn't a valid statement in the first place. It's like the rambling of a granddad that everything was better in the old days. It's partly wrong and partly true, but doesn't provide a beneficial contribution to a discussion.

I know a lot of people do this generalisation when they really mean
"If you watch lengthier commercials on TV all the time while paying for the monthly cable subscription and don't bat an eye, you shouldn't cry about those on the internet"


Sorry for Offtopic ^^

« Last Edit: April 18, 2014, 08:00:00 AM by Thunderbird »
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Merlandese

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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #18 on: April 18, 2014, 12:05:58 PM »
Well, in defense of his statement, we have a lot of debates threads here and among other forums, and the topic of adverts in YouTube videos is very popular and defended on both sides. Television commercials... we don't have any debates regarding those here, at least. And I personally don't hear about it elsewhere despite the constant discussions of "unfair" practices and hate on adverts. If our debate section can cover things from the military, to love, to child birth, to software, to adverts, and yet favors the discussion of YouTube commercials without ever discussing television commercials, I think it's safe to assume that if the other aspects of the two issues are similar, one is accepted and the other isn't.

So then it's a matter of selling that they both have commercials. That's easy, they do.

And then it's a matter of selling that one you pay for, and the other is free. That's also easy, because it's actual data-type stuff.

So with his argument, we know ('know" for the accepted part) those three things, and reaching his conclusion is an understandable jump.

EgotisticalRaven

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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #19 on: April 18, 2014, 08:21:52 PM »
I think the people don't complain about Television advertisements because the can't change them or remove them. People go on about the ads on Youtube because they can skip them, or refresh the page. I think people have come to accept that TVs have ads and there's nothing you can do about it.

I don't watch live Television that much (The last time I watched it was to watch Sherlock), I mostly watch DVDs or videos, but whenever I watch the TV, I always take the Mickey out of them.
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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #20 on: April 19, 2014, 04:27:02 AM »
I think the people don't complain about Television advertisements because the can't change them or remove them. People go on about the ads on Youtube because they can skip them, or refresh the page. I think people have come to accept that TVs have ads and there's nothing you can do about it.

I record the TV programmes I want to watch so I can fast-forward through the adverts  8)

However, this is definitely why people only complain about YT adverts as opposed to TV ones; the TV ads have been there for a very long time (and even if you record the programme you still have to skip forwards every 20 minutes), whilst some YT videos don't have adverts and some do making people feel entitled to not having ads on their YT videos.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2014, 04:30:57 AM by The-PurpleOrange »

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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #21 on: April 19, 2014, 06:59:23 AM »
TV ads have been there for a very long time (and even if you record the programme you still have to skip forwards every 20 minutes), whilst some YT videos don't have adverts and some do making people feel entitled to not having ads on their YT videos.
Adding to that, YouTube didn't used to make you watch ads in the first place. Sure, there have been banners and things like that on YouTube for a long time, but the forced video ads weren't always there (I don't remember having to sit through video ads on YT back in 2006). I feel that this adds to people's annoyance.
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Ferdk

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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #22 on: April 19, 2014, 10:48:45 AM »
Yeah, youtube didn't have these types of ads before, but if things stayed the way they were, YouTube wouldn't be what it is today. I know many people see it through nostalgia goggles, but the old youtube was an outdated piece of junk with junk content. It's the truth.

The inclusion of adverts has made possible for people to do a career as a content creator, and thus it has given us free quality content (not that there isn't any crap around, sure, but there's some gold to be found somewhere).

@Thunderbird

My point isn't that every single person watches TV commercials. My point is that mostly noone "fights" against it. Those who watch them just endure them, and those who don't well don't even other either. So, the practice itself of advertising on TV is almost never scrutinized, yet on the internet it's discussed all the time, even though YouTube is free as opposed to TV.
It does not matter that you don't pay for TV, you still can grasp the concept that the service is paid, right? even if you don't, you should be able to understand this concept. TV is paid, has ads, noone bats an eye. Sure, maybe some nutjob in a dark corner of the internet may have complained about it, but is it ever as often as people complain about internet ads? Not even close. And it should be MORE of a concern, considering you're already paying for the TV service. Imagine if you had to pay to watch a youtube video, and then you had ads on top of it. We'd never hear the end of it.

And for people who keep saying they record TV programs to skip ads: You can buy a computer screen capture software for less than a DVR. Then you can record all the youtube videos you want and "skip" the ads right away :)
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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #23 on: April 19, 2014, 11:23:03 AM »
Yeah, youtube didn't have these types of ads before, but if things stayed the way they were, YouTube wouldn't be what it is today. I know many people see it through nostalgia goggles, but the old youtube was an outdated piece of junk with junk content. It's the truth.

The inclusion of adverts has made possible for people to do a career as a content creator, and thus it has given us free quality content (not that there isn't any crap around, sure, but there's some gold to be found somewhere).

@Thunderbird

My point isn't that every single person watches TV commercials. My point is that mostly noone "fights" against it. Those who watch them just endure them, and those who don't well don't even other either. So, the practice itself of advertising on TV is almost never scrutinized, yet on the internet it's discussed all the time, even though YouTube is free as opposed to TV.
It does not matter that you don't pay for TV, you still can grasp the concept that the service is paid, right? even if you don't, you should be able to understand this concept. TV is paid, has ads, noone bats an eye. Sure, maybe some nutjob in a dark corner of the internet may have complained about it, but is it ever as often as people complain about internet ads? Not even close. And it should be MORE of a concern, considering you're already paying for the TV service. Imagine if you had to pay to watch a youtube video, and then you had ads on top of it. We'd never hear the end of it.

And for people who keep saying they record TV programs to skip ads: You can buy a computer screen capture software for less than a DVR. Then you can record all the youtube videos you want and "skip" the ads right away :)

A is bad and no one complains, so if B is also bad, you have no right to complain!
This argument is invalid.

But yeah, people probably are more used to those on TV, because they have grown up with those.
People usually complain about changes and the advertisments on youtube have changed in recent years.

Btw: Remember I'm not really against the ads, I think they do help giving more good content. ^^
There were some good videos on youtube before though, some people create good content for free.
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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #24 on: April 19, 2014, 12:18:06 PM »
A is bad and no one complains, so if B is also bad, you have no right to complain!
This argument is invalid.

That is not my argument at all. I'm just saying "why aren't people complaining about the worse of the two at all?", just pointing out the irony.
Besides I never said A is bad. I said, noone complains about A and most people don't find A bad, why is B bad then if it's the same but better (free)?

Quote
Btw: Remember I'm not really against the ads, I think they do help giving more good content. ^^
There were some good videos on youtube before though, some people create good content for free.

Not on the scale of today, no. Maybe some good vloggers and stuff, but not the level of production some channels have nowadays. And certainly not the same amount :P

For the record I already said I ultimately don't really care much, I just wanted to take part in the debate, but whether people use adblock or not doesn't really bother me, even if I happen to be a youtube content creator. I skip ads on my own videos so... :P
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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #25 on: April 19, 2014, 04:35:24 PM »
That is not my argument at all. I'm just saying "why aren't people complaining about the worse of the two at all?", just pointing out the irony.
Besides I never said A is bad. I said, noone complains about A and most people don't find A bad, why is B bad then if it's the same but better (free)?
But you don't know if those people that complain watch TV, you just assume it.

Quote
Not on the scale of today, no. Maybe some good vloggers and stuff, but not the level of production some channels have nowadays. And certainly not the same amount :P
Sure, the production scale is bigger as there is money to be made, no arguing about that.
But that doesn't mean that there wouldn't be any good stuff without it.

Quote
For the record I already said I ultimately don't really care much, I just wanted to take part in the debate, but whether people use adblock or not doesn't really bother me, even if I happen to be a youtube content creator. I skip ads on my own videos so... :P

My work was for free anyway, did only spent a couple of hours on creating videos though ^^
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Merlandese

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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #26 on: April 19, 2014, 04:51:34 PM »
There was this article I read about how people would feel ripped off through packaging even if they got the same, or even a better, deal.

The tests were done multiple ways, but the one that stuck out is that if you fill a 16oz cup eith 16oz of coffee and charge two dollars, people are fine with that. But if you charge two dollars, give 16oz of coffee, and put it in a 20oz cup, people will complain that they are being ripped off.

Somehow television is giving us the same amount of liquid as YouTube, but in a smaller cup, and so YouTube is the problem. (The reason YouTube's cup is bigger is probably because of what Atommo said about how there didn't used to be adverts, and now their are, whereas in our history of other media we have no knowledge of an advert-free period.)

Reives

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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #27 on: May 02, 2014, 09:27:56 PM »
Sorry this isn't entirely on-track with the current debate, but just wanted to share that when I was in China last year, the equivalent of youtube there (youku.com) has their ad at ~45 seconds (unskippable) for like, 5 minute videos. While people still complain about it there, it's become somewhat of a status quo.

It seems like Youtube's gradually and sneakily moving toward that direction too, with the introduction of shorter unskippables, and the randomized chance of getting that type of ads as opposed to the skip-in-5 ones being gradually increased as time goes on. It's interesting how we get accustomed to something when it's introduced gradually; it's kinda like being immunized to medicine. A lotta stuff online and offline have been like that even just in the past decade. D:
« Last Edit: May 02, 2014, 09:29:59 PM by Reives »

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Re: AdBlock
« Reply #28 on: May 03, 2014, 09:30:24 AM »
Well, last week I installed adBlock for exclusive use on Channel 4 onDemand which is basically a website that shows Channel 4 programs after they have been aired. Unfortunately it utilises adverts every 10-15 minutes for around 5 minutes at a time which makes watching programs on it unbearable.

I would have rather recorded the program on TV and skip forwards through the ads, but I missed the first episode so had to use the onDemand.